We need to combat the rise of fascism at the legal and legislative levels; Anthony Ballas tells ILNA

Anthony Ballas is an adjunct instructor. He currently teaches composition and rhetoric at the University of Colorado at Denver and philosophy and social sciences at Northern New Mexico College. He has published numerous articles, reviews, and book chapters on various topics ranging from music, literature, film, and architecture, to COVID-19, international politics, and the Haitian Revolution. He is currently editing two volumes: one the global rise of the far right and another on cinema and Liberation Theology. He is the host of the De Facto Podcast and you can find him on Twitter @tonyjballas.

Below is the ILNA's interview with this authoritative thinker and writer about the idea of fascism and, race, and racism.

ILNA: Fascism is now one of the political terms that is most frequently used. This phrase has been used typically in the media and in public discourse since the emergence of contemporary extremism (Trump, Bolsonaro, Johnson, etc.). Is the world of today fascist?

You know it’s interesting that you phrase the question in this way actually, as two things immediately come to mind. First of all, in an interview I did with  Alberto Toscano (which will hopefully be out soon), he actually surprised me by stating something similar to how you put it here in your question, namely that the term does appear to be more readily at hand today, and he brings up Jason Stanley’s work on fascism, for instance, as well as Joe Biden’s use of “semi-fascist” to describe Trump and the MAGA movement. I think Toscano is right to point out that the question of whether the term is affixed or not to figures like Trump, Bannon, Meloni of Italy or whoever is less important than how we theorise fascism and how that theory can be deployed politically.

The second thing that comes to mind is the work of Gerald Horne, who has written at least two books on U.S. fascism (The Counter-Revolution of 1836: Texas Slavery & Jim Crow and the Roots of U.S. Fascism from 2022 and The Color of Fascism: Lawrence Dennis, Racial Passing and the Rise of Right Wing Extremism in the United States from 2006). I was speaking with Horne on the topic of fascism recently and he told me that he was actually surprised to hear that there was even a discourse about whether or not the word ought to be used to describe these political formations we are seeing today, from Trump to Bolsonaro, to Orbán, etc. Incidentally, Horne said he first heard of this discourse over the use of the term while he was in conversation with Jason Stanley, who stated that the debate about terminology mostly exists in online forums and on social media.

Now certainly I don’t think it’s inaccurate to describe these contemporary forces as a fascist front — in fact I think it’s crucial. But I think it’s quite clear that we need to form a sharp analysis of what this might mean, which is why the work of all of the thinkers I just mentioned is so important. I should also add work done by the April Institute, an organization for anti-fascist education, which was co-founded by Julie Carr and, a former professor of mine, Chad Kautzer. Public discussion and media discussion of the term is not happenstance, but I think a rather reasonable reflection of what is really happening today.

I also think you’re right to bring this topic up in the context of a world fascism in your question; as a global phenomenon. There certainly are internationally coordinated and organized political and ideological forces that cross borders with a common aim; I’ve already mentioned Trump, but we should add Meloni and Bolsonaro, but we should also mention the Christian nationalist Jeanine Áñez, the former illegitimate president of Bolivia, who was sentenced to 10 years in prison for organizing the U.S.-backed coup against Evo Morales in 2019, and who was most recently indicted for the Senkata Massacre in which Bolivian police and armed forces targeted peaceful protestors, most of whom were indigenous, who set up a blockade in El Alto in protest of Morales’s ouster.

There is also Bolsonaro, who was suspiciously “on vacation” in Ron DeSantis’s Florida during the attempted coup of 8 January 2023 against the recently re-elected Lula Da Silva of Brasil. (Trump’s command center at Mar-a-Lago is also located in Florida, mind you). A couple things are important to mention here. It is not insignificant that Bolsonaro’s coup attempt came just two days after the two year anniversary of Trump’s attempted coup of 6 January 2021, and it is quite possible — I even think probable — that Bolsonaro planned 8 January from Florida. This conspiracy-theory laden narrative of voter-fraud is something that Bolsonaro and Trump, and actually Áñez as well, all have in common.

Florida’s Governor, Ron DeSantis — along with Ted Cruz of Texas — has been very vocal in opposition against Colombia's recently elected leftist president Gustavo Petro, former guerilla fighter, and Francia Márquez, the country’s first Black vice president, who is also an environmental activist. DeSantis has also spearheaded a major legal attack on LGBTQ+ rights in Florida, including the “Stop Woke” act and the “Don’t Say Gay” bill and others, as well as his attack on Critical Race Theory. We are seeing book bans, the defunding of libraries, and the continuation of stochastic terrorism in the United States and abroad. This is not a localised or isolated phenomenon.

There is a clear anti-Communist, anti-Black and anti-Trans ideology suffusing modern politics, which, although certainly nothing new, has become emboldened perhaps, or has once again reared its ugly, reactionary head. The QAnon conspiracy theory, violent anti-immigration, Christian nationalism and so on are all palpable in modern politics, and not just in the United States. I don’t think it’s much of an overstatement to suggest that the world today is trending toward neo-fascism, though I think it is perhaps more accurate, and probably more optimistic, to say that though we are marching down the road to neo-fascism at a global scale, we still can, and must, do everything possible to change this trajectory. We can still defeat this malignancy.

ILNA: Some analysts mention a new form of fascism that, in contrast to earlier fascisms, seeks to alter democratic systems from within. Accordingly, the so-called "post-fascism" is more dangerous than the previous 20th-century model. Is it possible to distinguish between fascism in its various modern and historical forms?

Although I am in general somewhat skeptical of appending the word “post-” to various concepts (postmodernism, poststructuralism, etc.), I think doing so with regard to fascism can be illuminating. “Post-fascism” refers essentially to the mainstreaming of fascist ideology in conservative political parties at the parliamentary and constitutional levels of government. This is not to be taken lightly, as I’ve already mentioned some of the attacks on LGTBQ+ and Black people at the legislative level in Florida, though we also shouldn’t forget the overturning of Roe v. Wade by the United States Supreme Court, and the ongoing attack on women’s reproductive rights. These represent forms of legal fascism perpetrated by conservative forces already occupying positions of political power. The recently inaugurated governor of Arkansas, Sarah Huckabee Sanders, had barely lifted her hand off of the Bible she was sworn in on before she gave an executive order banning Critical Race Theory in public education. It is quite alarming that such legal forces exist, and have immense legislative and ideological power in southern states, though this should come as no surprise given the region’s long legacy of white supremacist terrorism, slavery and settler colonialism. To call this “post-fascism,” however, may not necessary, as these forces have been present in American political parties, in the legislative branches, for centuries; Jim Crow, Indian relocation, the trail of tears — are these not, as Gerald Horne argues, part of the long history of American fascism? Just look at the recent expulsion (and eventual reinstatement) of Justin Jones and Justin Pearson, two young Black Representatives in Tennessee. They were expelled by a vote for participating in a protest against gun violence, which, as I’m sure your readers are well aware, still plagues the United States, particularly the southern states. It is not insignificant that these two Representatives were expelled though their white colleague, Gloria Johnson, was not despite participating in the same protest. This evinces the legacy of white supremacy coupled with modern fascism at the legislative level — so I suppose this does resemble something like post-fascism. Let me also mention that after a recent mass shooting in Nashville, which prompted the protests, Tennessee just passed a bill protecting gun manufacturers from being sued after a mass shooting occurs. This demonstrates the intersection of fascist legal processes, white supremacy, and corporate interest that is really nothing new in the United States. And what we are seeing unfold now in Montana with the passing of anti-Trans legislation and the overt silencing of Representative Zooey Zephyr or in Texas with Governor Greg Abbott and his efforts to pardon a man who murdered a Black Lives Matter activist, we should be paying serious attention to these fascist legal procedures.

I think it’s difficult to say whether or not a new form of fascism will be or perhaps is more dangerous than the 20th century model, as you put it. We know very well the devastation of European fascism in the 20th century, for instance, though we don’t often consider the liquidation of the indigenous, Jim Crow, U.S. and South African apartheid as part of this conversation. And furthermore we don’t pay enough attention to the ideological connection between all of the above — take for instance the work done by James Whitman on the influence of the United States’ race laws on the Nuremberg laws of the Nazis. It’s quite clear that we should. I think this is why Horne’s work is so important, as roots 20th and 21st century fascism in the history of white supremacy, slavery and settler colonialism, all in service of racial capitalism in the global context. This is the ideological formation that was essentially generative of western hemisphere, and so the contemporary rise of right wing extremism ought to be situated and understood as part of this history, which I think explains much of what we are witnessing.

What I mean to say by way of these examples is that measuring how violent one “kind” of fascism might be compared to another seems like a misdirected goal. I think we should take all fascisms seriously as having the potential for absolute destruction.

In terms of models, I think Jason Stanely’s work is quite useful, and important, as he parses out the differences between, for instance, a regime model of fascism, such as, say, Pinochet’s U.S.-backed dictatorship in Chile, or Hitler’s Nazi regime, or Mussolini’s Italy. There are also fascist forces and political strategies that regimes like these have in common, but also that we can see in contexts that aren’t part of a state apparatus (at least officially). The Ku Klux Klan — which was actually born in Tennessee — is a fascist group of white supremacist terrorists, that deployed lynch mobs and intimidation against minorities. David Duke, former grand wizard, as they call him, of the KKK was elected as a state representative in Louisiana in the 1990s. The economic and social scapegoating of said minority groups are fascist tactics that we find in various contexts, as well as the sort of “strongman” leader who mobilises foot soldiers against so-called “elites,” like Trump for instance, who, ironically, is one of these very elites himself.

There is also the ideological narrative of fascism, which very often situates itself as part of a traditional way of life and governance that romanticises the past, such as the Lost Cause, or today with Trump’s MAGA movement, which, as we know, stands for “Make America Great Again” — a narrative which we should immediately understand as ideological given that it is impossible to locate a period of American history that was “great,” especially for non-white people, gay people, and so on. This is what is now called “the great replacement theory” belonging to right wing extremists in the United States, who fear that Black people, Marxists, Transgender people and immigrants are endeavoring to replace white people and “traditional” American social, cultural and religious values — a narrative which should sound familiar to anyone with even a cursory understanding of the history of fascism. This goes hand-in-hand with the “stop the steal” movement, which is common in many fascist formations, some of which I’ve already mentioned.

So my point is that in terms of models we can look at different theoretical approaches to fascism; what fascism is is important, yes, but what fascism does, I think, can give us a good definition, as well as tools to combat it.

We might also look at certain other forms of fascism, such as fossil fascism, something Andreas Malm and the Zetkin Collective have theorised.

ILNA: In response to the infamous Fascist March on Rome, Antonio Gramsci believed a cogent communist strategy could thwart Mussolini's coup. History, of course, demonstrated that this notion was merely wishful thinking. Is it possible to discuss "anti-fascist instructions" today?

We have to make it possible. We need to combat the rise of fascism at the legal and legislative levels, which means not only putting pressure on politicians via activism, but also using electoral politics strategically, all while knowing they will not provide a perfect remedy. We need to build left-center, anti-fascist coalitions domestically and abroad.

We also need to combat the spread of fascism via the media, where it maintains a robust influence; even though Tucker Carlson recently split with Fox News, his influence is well known, and widespread. We’ve seen the mainstreaming of influential figures like Jordan Peterson, Kanye West, and others who quite openly spread fascist ideas. We need to keep an eye on Elon Musk and Twitter, as we know that social media has served as a recruitment tool for the far right, and has even radicalised overwhelmingly white, callow, male youth to perform acts of terrorism — the Buffalo massacre of 2022, Dylann Roof in Charleston in 2015 and others. White supremacist terrorists are quite often conscripted online, and we need to find solutions to this phenomenon.

ILNA: Gerald Horne writes in "The Color of Fascism" about the hypocrisy of racial relations in the US and how legal alienation aided in the rise of fascism. However, some contend that without a clear understanding of what fascism actually entails, it is difficult to justify the need for fascist rhetoric to be taboo in public discourse. Can racial alienation in the US be used to discuss the traits of global fascism?

I think it certainly can. I already mentioned James Whitman’s work, the book is called Hitler’s American Model by the way, as well as Horne’s. Horne even discusses the influence of the American counter-revolution on the South African apartheid regime. And we can also see similar racial inflection adhering to anti-immigrant sentiment in Hungary, for instance, or what we recently witnessed at the Ukraine-Poland border with regard to fleeing African students in 2022. Let’s not forget about the reservation system in the United States, which, as Horne has discussed, strikingly resembled the Bantustans in South Africa.

In her famous address at Howard University in 1995, Toni Morrison detailed the intimate—some might even say (and I think they’d be right) the intrinsic—connection between racism and fascism. Constructing and criminalizing an internal enemy, subject that enemy to an ideological barrage of coded language and abuse, pathologize the enemy and so on. Sound familiar? We not only find these tactics employed in fascist regimes like Nazi Germany, but in the United States even today; mass incarceration, the criminalization of non-white people, immigrants, Black people and so on. Scientific racism and the history of the so-called “criminal mind,” which Stephen J. Gould write about in The Mismeasure of Man is not to be taken lightly in terms of how it enables forms of fascism. We see this today on mainstream news in fact; rhetoric that pathologizes Black culture as morally hazardous, violent and so forth is used to not only criminalize Black people, but to divert attention from the history of American racism, economic devastation and dispossession, police brutality and murder, as well as justify the mass incarceration regime in this country. We see also these tactics deployed in the United States and under Bolsonaro’s Brasil with regard to anti-Transgender rhetoric — something that has even spread to the left I’m afraid.

I think it is difficult if not impossible to extricate the problem of race from the problem of fascism — and it’s unnecessary to think we ought to. As Horne details in his work, there the “race question” was bound up with, for instance, U.S. fascism very early on in the 20th century with the figure of Lawrence Dennis, a Black man who passed for white. Today we are seeing a similar phenomenon in the American context; fascist figures who are certainly not white like Kanye West, Ali Alexander (who was instrumental in the attempted coup of 6 January), Enrique Tarrio of the Proud Boys (also instrumental in the coup), or who claim to have some non-white roots like Stewart Rhodes of the Oath Keepers (also instrumental), are cropping up shoulder to shoulder with white supremacists, involved in the MAGA movement, sympathetic with Tucker Carlson and so on. This ought to demonstrate how intimately connected the question of race is to fascism today.

We can see how fascism is manifesting with regard to racial alienation — in fact, it’s quite apparent. I already mentioned what’s happening in Florida under Ron DeSantis and in Arkansas under S.H. Sanders, and the banning of certain fields of study, such as Critical Race Theory, and the explicit mention of banned authors, most of whom are Black, like Angela Davis and Robin D.G. Kelley and Kimberlé Crenshaw and others.

Some people have described these things as “isolated incidents” which is a premise that should not even be taken seriously. Fascism and gun violence, and gun culture more generally, as Chad Kautzer has examined in some of his work, are connected intimately. And gun culture in the United States and abroad is also deeply connected with racism, xenophobia, anti-Immigration as well as Christian Nationalism. Here in the United States, as is well known, we have a serious problem with gun violence, mass shootings as well as state and vigilante gun violence, much of which is racially-motivated.

We often hear allegations of “identity politics” or so-called “wokeness” when the question of race comes to the table. I think these are the very diversion tactics that Morrison spoke about in the 1990s as part and parcel of fascist ideology. They are intrinsic, as I said, not incidental. U.S. fascism has been very influential in this regard, which should not be a surprise as it is the world’s imperial power — the police of the world. Without an understanding of race, racism and the ideological functions thereof, I don’t think we’ll form a robust enough analysis of the current trend toward neo-fascism domestically or at a global scale.

Interview by: Kamran Baradaran